Stellaris

Stellaris

Administrative Upgrades
Fun and interesting but needs more balancing. =D
I really love the idea of this mod but it's unbalanced sadly. :(

Some ideas to take with a grain of salt that could be a good change... :)

Looking at the numbers the higher tier buildings should have their admin cap bonus reduced drastically, also there are way too many jobs being added and it might work better if there were also a specific job type that granted admin cap (manager, ruler, produces +2 Admin Cap, +1 stability, upkeep na, priority 2), the relative build costs and upkeep aren't all that limiting and the trade off is more than worth it. Agreed that the Tier 1 building is a bit more chancy when to build since it starts off with a sprawl penalty- however that will completely discourage a lot of people to use the mod and needs to have a counter to consider which in the early game something to increase cohesion might be a good thing.

One thing I was thinking is the idea that the buildings reduce amenities while increasing stability could be another nice touch to be added. While looking at upkeep as mostly energy seemed not all that exciting, adding in a unity upkeep makes things interesting possibly, it doesn't affect consumer goods but does mean more consideration to build something that increases unity and thereby decreases consumer goods. Overall how good that is will depend on peoples play style anyway.

Here's what might be a more balanced and interesting set of buildings for consideration;


Tier I (upgraded capital / 10pop)
-clerk 1
-manager 1
-empire cohesion modifier -10%
-empire sprawl +1%
-admin cap +4
-amenities -3
-stability +1
-build; time 360, 250 min, 25 unity
-upkeep; 6 energy, 5 unity

Tier II (upgraded major capital / 40pop)
-clerk 2
-manager 2
-empire cohesion modifier -10%
-empire sprawl +1%
-admin cap +8
-amenities -6
-stability +2
-build; time 400, 500 min, 100 unity
-upkeep; 12 energy, 20 unity

Tier III (fully upgraded capital / 80pop)
-clerk 4
-manager 3
-empire cohesion modifier -10%
-empire sprawl +1%
-admin cap +16
-amenities -12
-stability +4
-build; time 675, 1000 min, 400 unity
-upkeep; 24 energy, 80 unity

Tier IV (fully upgraded capital / 80pop)
-clerk 5
-manager 5
-empire cohesion modifier -10%
-empire sprawl +1%
-admin cap +32
-amenities -15
-stability +5
-build; time 900, 1500 min, 1600 unity
-upkeep; 48 energy, 320 unity

The manager giving a bonus to stability might be overboard. It could also go instead with manger; Clerk Amenities Output: +10%.


The starbase improvement seems decent, it only needs to have the bonus displayed on admin cap to be a single line.

Edict is really powerful, well it should be if the actual admin cap bonuses of the buildings weren't so good already. I'd suggest something cheaper but not as powerful, there aren't that many inexpensive edicts so something like 50 influence for +5% admin cap and -10% urban sprawl and empire cohesion maybe.

Just some thoughts, I really like the mod, I just can't justify how good it is. ;)
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Showing 1-5 of 5 comments
tonechild  [developer] 14 Aug, 2019 @ 4:37pm 
Thanks, I too think this mod is overpowered. I tried to balance it and got backlash, which made me a bit gunshy. I don't think I've made something with so many subscribers before, and so now I've been just too afraid to make any changes.

I don't even use this mod, it makes the game too easy. I would like to balance it, but, if I do, it has to be incremental. I like what youre suggesting, and if we can figure out how to roll out changes that are very mild it might be better.
Last edited by tonechild; 14 Aug, 2019 @ 4:42pm
JayBee 🔰 15 Aug, 2019 @ 12:32pm 
It's a bit crazy you got backlash for making your own mod but people can be fickle that's always a certainty. 8]

I agree that given the fiery nature that incremental is best, you don't want a riot on your hands. ;)

STRATEGIC RESOURCES

I looked at base strategic resources and gas is the most used for buildings, motes and crystals are about tied about 20% below gas. Although crystals arguably are the least used. I listed and alternative which has the same effective cost (if people needed to buy from the market or trade to get it) using more strategic resources than money. I think it would make the building seem more valuable and special.

Maintenance for Level 2 buildings cost about one resource, level 3 two resources and level 4 four resources. and build cost is 50x that. So extrapolating and massaging the numbers I plugged them in below.


To that end I'd suggest starting with (of course these are just suggestions);

STAGE I

--) CLERK JOBS
From 3/6/9/12 to 2/4/6/8

--) MANAGER JOBS (if you like them, then replace the unusual researcher jobs)
From researcher 1/2/3/4 to manager 1/2/4/5

--) BUILDING REQ Enforce the building pop requirements, this shouldn't cause an uproar but it's also needlessly overpowering and a bit different than normal.

--) BUILDING TIMES
From 125/240/340/400 to 200/300/400/600

--) COST
From energy 40/160/320/640 to unity 20/120/240/640
From mineral 200/400/600/800 to mineral 250/500/700/1200
From exotic gas 0/0/4/8 to exotic gas 0/5/10/20
From nothing to motes 0/5/10/20
From nothing to crystals 0/5/10/20

--) UPKEEP
From energy 4/16/32/64 to energy 1/2/4/8
From nothing to unity 5/10/20/80
From exotic gas 0/0/2/4 to exotic gas 0/1/2/3
From nothing to motes 0/1/1/2
From nothing to crystals 0/1/1/2

--) ADMIN CAP
Keep in mind the manager jobs would add extra admin cap of 2/4/6/8/10
From 4/16/32/64 to 4/10/20/40 (w/ managers it's 6/14/28/50)

--) HEARTS & MINDS
amenities -1/-2/-4/-5 & stability +1/+1/+2/+3


x) Fix the starbase admin cap bonuses to be on a single line (though I haven't found how to do that myself).

y) Adding a bonus to empire cohesion, which offhand I can't find the modifier for but it surely must be possible. Although I think this is a good way to give a boost early game that's balanced I was actually surprised at how many people seem to want this since they play on high connectivity maps. A lot more people will end up using the mod for that reason I think.

z) ASCENSION PERKS
Imperial Perogative, has been effectively become heavily nerfed, either leave it as it is or perhaps add a bonus to manager jobs (eg +3 admin cap per job instead of +2 is pretty good but not insane). Also let's face it, die-hards of the mods concept either already take the perk or because it's not relevant anymore by mid-game don't- and then would love and extra bonus and it'll keep with their theme and play style to take it making is worthwhile.

STAGE II

--) CLERK JOBS
From 3/6/9/12 to 2/3/5/7

--) BUILDING TIMES
From 125/240/340/400 to 300/400/550/750

--) COST
From energy 40/160/320/640 to unity 20/80/200/640
From mineral 200/400/600/800 to mineral 250/500/850/1500
From exotic gas 0/0/4/8 to exotic gas 0/15/25/50
From nothing to motes 0/15/25/50
From nothing to crystals 0/15/25/50

--) UPKEEP
From energy 4/16/32/64 to energy 1/2/4/8
From nothing to unity 5/10/30/120
From exotic gas 0/0/2/4 to exotic gas 0/1/2/3
From nothing to motes 0/1/2/2
From nothing to crystals 0/1/2/2

--) ADMIN CAP
From 4/16/32/64 to 4/8/18/36 (w/ managers it's 6/12/26/46)
From 4/16/32/64 to 4/8/16/32 (w/ managers it's 6/12/24/42)

--) HEARTS & MINDS
amenities -2/-4/-8/-15 & stability +1/+2/+3/+4


STAGE III

--) CLERK JOBS
From 3/6/9/12 to 1/2/4/5

--) BUILDING TIMES
From 125/240/340/400 to 360/400/675/900

--) COST
From energy 40/160/320/640 to unity 20/40/160/640
From mineral 200/400/600/800 to mineral 250/500/1000/2000
From exotic gas 0/0/4/8 to exotic gas 0/25/50/75
From nothing to motes 0/25/50/75
From nothing to crystals 0/25/50/75

--) UPKEEP
From energy 4/16/32/64 to energy 1/2/4/8
From nothing to unity 5/10/40/160
From exotic gas 0/0/2/4 to exotic gas 0/1/2/3
From nothing to motes 0/1/2/3
From nothing to crystals 0/1/2/3

--) ADMIN CAP
From 4/16/32/64 to 4/8/16/32 (w/ managers it's 6/12/24/42)

--) HEARTS & MINDS
amenities -3/-6/-12/-15 & stability +1/+2/+4/+5

***

So Admn Cap is nerfed, but honestly, it's not a huge nerf and likely will still require more nerfing, however after implementing these changes in three stages and asking users honestly if the changes are too much of a nerf. If people just want to ignore admin cap there are 100's of mods out there that effectively shut it off. Your mod has a nice system on making choices to deal with admin cap, the choices are interesting, they shouldn't be a way to completely ignore admin cap for no reason since there's other ways to do that.

Manager random fake code since I haven't used it before;

admincap_manager = {
category = ruler
condition_string = RULER_JOB_TRIGGER
building_icon = building_admin_base_fd34a3dcef054afc8096415bd91013f0
clothes_texture_index = 4

possible = {
ruler_job_check_trigger = yes
}

resources = {
category = planet_manager
produces = {
country_admin_cap_add = 2 #works for a living
amenities = 1 #comfy waiting room chairs
}
upkeep = {
energy = 1 #lotsa bribes
consumergood = 1 #gold-plated pencils
food = 1 #caviar is expensive
}
}



Last edited by JayBee 🔰; 15 Aug, 2019 @ 12:57pm
JayBee 🔰 15 Aug, 2019 @ 12:57pm 
The AI will need some updates, first to take into account the planets amenities so as to not build it on planets that don't have enough, the AI should only build one type of admin building at a time so it doesn't get itself into a problem, and probably to ensure that it had a high enough income to deal with upkeep.

untested code bits with some fake code because I've got to do errands and lack time ;)

-kept building off habitats, put building location at top
-increase chances to build on capital and major planets
-decrease chance to build otherwise
-don't build multiples at once
-don't build useless

building_admin_base_fd34a3dcef054afc8096415bd91013f0 = {
base_buildtime = 360
# base_buildtime = 145
base_cap_amount = 1
add_to_first_building_slot = yes

category = government

potential = {
exists = owner
NOT = { is_planet_class = pc_habitat }
NOT = { has_modifier = resort_colony }
NOT = { has_modifier = slave_colony }
}

allow = {
has_upgraded_capital = yes
}

triggered_planet_modifier = {
potential = {
exists = owner
owner = { is_gestalt = no }
}
modifier = {
job_clerk_add = 1
job_admincap_manager_add = 1
}
}


////////////


prerequisites = { "tech_building_admin_base_fd34a3dcef054afc8096415bd91013f0" }

ai_weight = {
weight = 1.0
modifier = {
factor = 5.0
OR = {
is_capital = yes
is_planet_class = pc_city
is_planet_class = pc_ringworld_habitable
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.1 # Slows building multiples to check for issues
owner = {
any_owned_planet = {
has_building_construction = building_admin_base_fd34a3dcef054afc8096415bd91013f0
}
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 10 #completely madeup to increase likelihood to build if neg admin
owner = {
has_admincap_negative = {
resource = admincap
value < -50
}
modifier = {
factor = 0 #completely madeup to decrease likelihood to build if pos admin
owner = {
has_admincap_postivie = {
resource = admincap
value > 0
}
Last edited by JayBee 🔰; 15 Aug, 2019 @ 1:13pm
JayBee 🔰 25 Aug, 2019 @ 9:51am 
Had a look at weighting and I've been trying this; :)



tech_building_admin_base_fd34a3dcef054afc8096415bd91013f0 = {
cost = @tier1cost1
area = society
tier = 1
category = { new_worlds }
prerequisites = { "tech_planetary_unification" }
weight = @tier1weight3

modifier = {
country_admin_cap_add = 5
}

weight_modifier = {
modifier = {
factor = 0.1
NOT = { years_passed > 10 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.5
years_passed > 20
}
modifier = {
factor = 2
any_neighbor_country = {
has_technology = tech_building_admin_base_fd34a3dcef054afc8096415bd91013f0
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 0
num_owned_planets < 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 2
num_owned_planets > 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 2
num_owned_planets > 6
}
modifier = {
factor = 2
num_owned_planets > 9
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.75 # 75% if the empire does not have any of the following ethics.
NOR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25 # +25% if the empire has both ethics.
AND = {
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic authoritarian.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic militarist.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
has_tradition = tr_expansion_adopt
}
modifier = {
factor = 3.75
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}

ai_weight = {
weight = 10
factor = 5 #scaling
modifier = {
factor = 100
has_technology = tech_colonial_bureaucracy
}
factor = 5
modifier = {
factor = 2
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}
}

tech_building_admin_upgrade_698418100b80455aadbdc33b0663b285 = {
cost = @tier2cost2
area = society
tier = 2
category = { new_worlds }
prerequisites = { "tech_colonial_bureaucracy" "tech_building_admin_base_fd34a3dcef054afc8096415bd91013f0" }
weight = @tier2weight2

modifier = {
country_admin_cap_add = 5
}

weight_modifier = {
modifier = {
factor = 0.1
NOT = { years_passed > 20 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.5
years_passed > 40
}
modifier = {
factor = 2
any_neighbor_country = {
has_technology = tech_building_admin_upgrade_698418100b80455aadbdc33b0663b285
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 0
num_owned_planets < 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.75
num_owned_planets > 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.75
num_owned_planets > 6
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.75
num_owned_planets > 9
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.75 # 75% if the empire does not have any of the following ethics.
NOR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25 # +25% if the empire has both ethics.
AND = {
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic authoritarian.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic militarist.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
has_tradition = tr_expansion_adopt
}
modifier = {
factor = 3.75
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}

ai_weight = {
weight = 10
factor = 5 #scaling
modifier = {
factor = 100
has_technology = tech_colonial_centralization
}
factor = 5
modifier = {
factor = 2
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}
}

tech_building_admin_upgrade_2_e6e714350561429ca8496c74d68eede0 = {
cost = @tier3cost2
area = society
tier = 3
category = { new_worlds }
prerequisites = { "tech_colonial_centralization" "tech_building_admin_upgrade_698418100b80455aadbdc33b0663b285" }
weight = @tier3weight1

modifier = {
country_admin_cap_add = 5
}

weight_modifier = {
modifier = {
factor = 0.1
NOT = { years_passed > 40 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.5
years_passed > 80
}
modifier = {
factor = 2
any_neighbor_country = {
has_technology = tech_building_admin_upgrade_2_e6e714350561429ca8496c74d68eede0
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 0
num_owned_planets < 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.5
num_owned_planets > 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.5
num_owned_planets > 6
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.5
num_owned_planets > 9
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.75 # 75% if the empire does not have any of the following ethics.
NOR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25 # +25% if the empire has both ethics.
AND = {
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic authoritarian.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic militarist.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
has_tradition = tr_expansion_adopt
}
modifier = {
factor = 3.75
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}

ai_weight = {
weight = 10
factor = 5 #scaling
modifier = {
factor = 100
has_technology = tech_galactic_bureaucracy
}
factor = 5
modifier = {
factor = 2
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}
}

tech_building_admin_upgrade_3_dc7cbd9df41746669e9d763e9abf84f1 = {
cost = @tier4cost3
area = society
tier = 4
category = { new_worlds }
prerequisites = { "tech_galactic_bureaucracy" "tech_building_admin_upgrade_2_e6e714350561429ca8496c74d68eede0" }
weight = @tier4weight1
is_rare = yes

modifier = {
country_admin_cap_add = 5
}

weight_modifier = {
modifier = {
factor = 0.1
NOT = { years_passed > 80 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.5
years_passed > 160
}
modifier = {
factor = 2
any_neighbor_country = {
has_technology = tech_building_admin_upgrade_2_e6e714350561429ca8496c74d68eede0
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 0
num_owned_planets < 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
num_owned_planets > 3
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
num_owned_planets > 6
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
num_owned_planets > 9
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.75 # 75% if the empire does not have any of the following ethics.
NOR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25 # +25% if the empire has both ethics.
AND = {
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_authoritarian
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
OR = {
has_ethic = ethic_militarist
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
}
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic authoritarian.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_authoritarian
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.125 # +12.5% if the empire is fanatic militarist.
has_ethic = ethic_fanatic_militarist
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
has_tradition = tr_expansion_adopt
}
modifier = {
factor = 3.75
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}

ai_weight = {
weight = 10
factor = 5 #scaling
modifier = {
factor = 100
has_technology = tech_galactic_bureaucracy
}
factor = 5
modifier = {
factor = 2
research_leader = {
area = society
has_trait = "leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
}
}
}
}

JayBee 🔰 25 Aug, 2019 @ 9:56am 
So the tier cost starts out low and goes high to increase players interest and balance the benefits, and the weight goes down for the higher techs. I've also tried to adjust appearance based on militarist and authoritarian ethics or lack there of. And based on planets the chance the techs show up is modified on a sliding scale or planets and higher techs, finally based on game years the techs are also weighted.

Still haven't seen the AI doing a lot of research and building but I've tweaked it to be more likely to do research, especially if neighbours have it.
Last edited by JayBee 🔰; 25 Aug, 2019 @ 9:58am
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